by Jeremy Carden
by Jeremy Carden
By Jeremy Carden
Since Battle of Gods, DBZ fans have been debating about Super Saiyan 4 vs. Super Saiyan God.
With the new Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan transformation revealed, the debated has sparked even more controversy. Despite the ongoing debate between fans, there has been no clear definitive answer as to which form is superior.
Most fans are quick to say that it does not matter how powerful Super Saiyan 4 is because GT is not canon. Not to mention with Dragon Ball Super on the horizon, it is set to “erase” GT from existence. I will get into my thoughts on that in another blog, but for now the focus will be on which Super Saiyan transformation is superior.
It has never been fully established how powerful these new forms are when compared to the standard Super Saiyan forms. Which forms am I referring to?
These 3 below:
Here is what we do know about the standard Super Saiyan forms:
The missing factor in all of this involves how much more powerful Super Saiyan God is when compared to Super Saiyan 3.
We know that Beerus took out Super Saiyan 3 Goku with a simple flick to the forehead, and a well placed karate chop to a pressure point on Goku’s neck.
However, Beerus tried this same karate chop on Super Saiyan God Goku, but it failed to work! This shows us that Goku’s power has increased to astounding new heights!
It was one of those blink-and-you-miss moments during the beginning of their battle.
In the end, 70% Beerus was able to defeat 80% Super Saiyan God Goku; remember that Goku never fought at 100% with his new power.
Saiyan beyond God is a “form” that Goku and Vegeta reach after the events of Battle of Gods, and during their time as students under Whis.
A Saiyan prodigy who transforms into Super Saiyan God will revert back to base form after the Super Saiyan God form time limit runs out. However, they will absorb the power of the Super Saiyan God into their base form. This will result in the Saiyan becoming a Saiyan beyond God.
It reminds me of Ultimate Gohan because in his “base form” he has far more power than he ever did as a Super Saiyan 1 or 2. The reason I say “base form” is because as Ultimate Gohan his outer appearance barely changes from his regular appearance.
When it comes to Saiyan beyond God vs. the appearance of base Goku or Vegeta, the only change is the color of their aura. It becomes more of a milky white color when compared to their standard base form aura.
When a Saiyan beyond God has access to the Super Saiyan transformation…they can become a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan!
It is unknown how much more powerful this makes a Saiyan beyond God, or how much more powerful this form is when compared to a Super Saiyan God.
Most fans are quick to assume that just like the standard Super Saiyan transformation; it increases a Saiyan’s power 50 times over the power of his base power. In this case, “base power” is considered Saiyan beyond God.
Wait, does that mean a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is 50 times the power of a Super Saiyan God?
Saiyan beyond God is basically a Saiyan in base form that has mastered or absorbed the power of a Super Saiyan God into their body right?
Although it is not official, I can see why most fans would assume that Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is superior to a Super Saiyan God by 50 times.
However, the Super Saiyan multiplier scale seems to conflict with Akira Toriyama’s own power scale for the gods.
He stated his own personal belief on the power differences between the Battle of Gods characters below:
Super Saiyan God Goku is about a “6”, Beerus a “10” and Whis about a “15”.
To me this never made much sense, and please do not think that I am debating the word of the official creator of Dragon Ball Z. However, the key phrase here is that these levels are Akira’s “own personal belief.”
With that being said, I think it is fair for me (or any other fan for that matter) to have my own personal belief as well.
As I mentioned before, Beerus was only fighting at 70% power when he battled Super Saiyan God Goku. The Saiyan never truly fought at 100% with his new godly power. His time limit in the form ran out before he could kick things up to full power.
True, Beerus mentioned that Goku absorbed the power of the Super Saiyan God into his base form, and from there transformed into a Super Saiyan. That explained why he was able to fight on par with Beerus for some time, and he did not even notice that his Super Saiyan God fuel had burned out until Beerus mentioned it to him.
Some may argue that Goku fought Beerus as a Saiyan beyond God after his Super Saiyan God power fizzled out like a flat can of soda.
Others might mention that Goku fighting Beerus as a Full Power Super Saiyan with the power of a Super Saiyan God was a potential foreshadowing of the Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan!
Both are valid points, and I think they are worth mentioning.
Now here is where my opinion is slightly different than Akira’s own personal belief. If my math is mistaken, please feel free to let me know in the comment section below (and be respectful because we are all human, and mistakes can be made).
If Beerus (at 70% power) was fighting Super Saiyan God Goku (at 80% power), wouldn’t this imply that Beerus is at best only 10% more powerful than Super Saiyan God Goku?
That conflicts with Goku being a 6, and Beerus being a 10. The gap of 4 seems to imply much more than a 10% difference in strength. My opinion is that Akira did not write Battle of Gods with the intention of having an exact measuring system of power levels.
Remember that they were only introduced into the series so the characters and fans would come to realize how useless they really were.
Considering that Trunks at level 5 was the last power level scanned in the series, I am sure that we can assume that in the interview, Akira did not have an exact figure in his head regarding the power of the gods. We just know that Whis is more powerful than Beerus, and Beerus is more powerful than Goku.
To me, Full Power Super Saiyan Goku (with the power of Super Saiyan God) was not as powerful as he was when he was a Super Saiyan God. I say this because Goku was experiencing the power for the very first time, and he did not have full mastery over his new power yet.
After training with Whis, I suspect the Saiyan beyond God version of Goku is superior to even his Super Saiyan God form from Battle of Gods (to a certain extent).
We then find out that the Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is basically a Super Saiyan fighting with the power of a Super Saiyan God.
Wait, does that mean Goku could become a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan 2 and a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan 3?
I am not going to go down that rabbit hole because we could be going back and forth about this for an eternity. If Goku could indeed reach those forms then as a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan 3, his power would be 400 times the power of a Saiyan beyond God!
Now to get back on track, Saiyan beyond God is superior to Super Saiyan God in the sense that this is a base form Saiyan that has mastered the Super Saiyan God transformation.
What does this mean?
It means that base form Goku and Vegeta can fight with the power of a Super Saiyan God, but the time limit of the godly form is no longer a handicap.
Again a comparison can be made to Ultimate Gohan vs. Super Saiyan 3. Gohan is allowed to fight with his maximum power without his Ki supply being quickly drained like a Super Saiyan 3.
Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is the next stage of a superior Super Saiyan God because it also allows a Saiyan to fight with the power of the Super Saiyan God, but without any sort of time limit handicap.
I know we have covered a lot of ground so far, but let’s do a quick recap just to be sure we are on the same page.
Saiyan beyond God is the base form of a Saiyan that has now mastered and retained the power of a Super Saiyan God. Any Saiyan that is capable of becoming a Super Saiyan can take their Saiyan beyond God stage to the level of a Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan.
Both of these incarnations of a Saiyan can be considered superior in power to the Super Saiyan God transformation.
Moving onto GT, although it was never officially stated; Goku in base form is said to be as powerful as he was at the Super Saiyan 3 level in DBZ (specifically in the Buu Saga, not the 10 year gap between the death of Kid Buu and the departure of Goku with Uub).
This made me cringe as a child when I heard this because I was difficult to believe that Kid Goku (GT) was on par with the Super Saiyan 3 that we had seen fighting with Kid Buu!
However, most fans associate Goku’s power to Super Saiyan 3 because of his statement to General Rilldo about the Machine Mutant being more powerful than even Majin Buu.
Goku actually fights on par (and even has the upper hand for a good portion of the fight) with Rilldo, and that is why most fans say he was at the power of a Buu Saga Super Saiyan 3 Goku. It is also worth mentioning that this is in reference to Rilldo’s first form, and not his other 2 transformation that make Goku power up to Super Saiyan 1 which makes him 50 times more powerful than before.
Things can get extremely complicated when thinking about a base form Goku being on par with his Super Saiyan 3 form from DBZ.
Think of it this way:
Kid Goku (GT) in base form = Super Saiyan 3 Goku from Buu Saga.
This would mean GT Goku is 400 times the power of base power Goku from the Buu Saga!
What does this mean in terms of the Super Saiyan multipliers when applied to GT Goku?
Meaning that Super Saiyan 4 Goku in GT is 4,000 times the power of Super Saiyan 3 Goku from the Buu Saga!
Yes, I find this mind blowing as well because it all goes back to what Vegeta from the Team Four Star Abridged series of DBZ said about power levels:
Alright, at this point the question arises as to which form of Goku would come out on top if Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan met Super Saiyan 4.
I am willing to bet that in terms of power alone…the winner would be Super Saiyan 4.
Hear me out on this:
We know that Super Saiyan God is more powerful than Super Saiyan 3, but we do not know by how much. Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is speculated (and keep in mind that it is not official) to be 50 times the power of a Saiyan beyond God, and this “form” is literally a base form Saiyan with the power of a Super Saiyan God.
Fans speculate Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan to be 50 times the power of a Super Saiyan God.
The reason I feel that Super Saiyan 4 Goku is more powerful is simply because a base form Goku that is equal in power to a Buu Saga Super Saiyan 3 Goku is just insane to think about because he gets a 4,000 times power increase at Super Saiyan 4.
I will say that we do know Saiyan beyond God Goku is more powerful than GT base form Goku.
It has been said many times that Saiyan beyond Goku is basically Super Saiyan God Goku (just without the drastic change in appearance), and that would mean his power is much higher than Super Saiyan 3 Goku!
However, if Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan is indeed only 50 times the power of Saiyan beyond God (or Super Saiyan God), I feel that it goes without saying that a 50-fold power increase would not be able to matchup to a Super Saiyan 4 GT Goku.
Super Saiyan GT Goku alone is already 50 times the power of Super Saiyan 3 DBZ Goku, which increases to 100 times as a Super Saiyan 2, and 400 times as a Super Saiyan 3…
I do not think that Super Saiyan God is that much of a power-up when compared to Super Saiyan 3.
If Goku were to fully master his training under Whis in order to become a perfect warrior, he would have an advantage over Super Saiyan 4 Goku.
Remember that Whis pointed out Goku’s main flaw as being too relaxed in battle, and that leaves him open to attack. This can lead to his defeat by a weaker opponent, and we saw this happen when Sorbet blasted him through the heart with his ring laser!
Can you imagine a Goku that was flawless in combat? True, Super Saiyan 4 is more powerful, but that version of Goku would not have the training of Whis to back him up!
I am keeping “GT Goku” and “Battle of Gods Goku” as separate entities during this fight.
Some fans are probably reading this and would consider the fight to be over in a matter of seconds! I mean Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan Goku would just need to cut off Super Saiyan 4 Goku’s tail!
Yes, I know that would be a way of ending the fight very quickly. However, who would want to see that as the ending of such an epic battle?
I know that I would not want this battle between Super Saiyans to be over before it begun due to Super Saiyan 4 Goku’s main handicap.
Something else that needs to be taken into consideration is that Super Saiyan 4 and Super Saiyan God/Super Saiyan God Super Saiyan are completely different levels. I mean Super Saiyan 4 seems to fit into the same spectrum as the first 3 Super Saiyan levels.
However, Super Saiyan God is in a league of its own. It is a being of such divine energy and power that it cannot be sensed by “lesser beings” through the use of a Ki signature. I do not think that this means Super Saiyan God is automatically more powerful than Super Saiyan 4 (because in GT, it is mentioned on more than one occasion by other characters that Goku’s Ki is incredible in the form; meaning “lesser beings” can sense his presence), but it means that it is in a different realm of power.
Super Saiyan God is a powerful form, but until we are officially given the stats on how much more powerful it is than a Super Saiyan 3; this debate will most likely continue on.
Which form do you think is more powerful?
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by Jeremy Carden
I know there are a lot of Yamcha memes circulating on the Internet, but this one has got to be one of the worst out there. Most of the memes make fun of the human Z-Fighter, but this one…
This particular meme is a boastful meme of how Yamcha is better than Goku or Vegeta when placed in certain circumstances. There are a total of 6 different responses to everyone’s negative opinions about Yamcha. I’ll list them out below and describe why I feel they are ridiculous.
#1 It took me one death to realize being cocky or underestimating your enemy is a weakness where it took Vegeta to see Super Saiyan 3 Goku in action to understand this
Vegeta’s trademark isn’t just the Galick Gun or the Final Flash it is his EGO and PRIDE! Maybe if Yamcha had more of that Bulma would not have left him for Vegeta! That passion to be the best was what made Vegeta train to be the #1 in the universe. Yamcha on the other hand just lounged around Capsule Corp. and did well…nothing. Vegeta died TWICE and still fought on to be the best even if he was blinded by pride.
I’d say that Vegeta had far more growth by the end of the series when compared to Yamcha despite meeting Goku way back in Dragonball! Seeing Goku at his best fighting the pink menace (after getting beaten by Kid Buu himself), Vegeta understood who Goku was not as a Saiyan warrior but as a PERSON! I think while fused with Goku as Vegito, Vegeta was able to see Goku for who he truly was.
Yamcha on the other hand did see the importance of not underestimating his opponents early on in DBZ. However, he became more of a coward on the battlefield than a warrior. That alone is why this statement just makes him love very bad…
#2 I made it to King Kai’s house a lot faster then Goku and don’t use “Goku falling off of Snake Way as an excuse
Here is one that annoys me: Tien, Yamcha, Piccolo and Chiaotzu making it down Snake Way faster than Goku (even minus Princess Snake and falling off into Hell detours). The comparison isn’t fair at all!
Goku’s base power was only 416 (without weights) and let’s just say that after death it was the same (unless you count a Zenkai for him keeping his body after dying but in this case let’s not) and if you count him eating that fruit from Yemma’s tree doubling his strength we could say it was 832 and now compare that to the Z-Fighters after training to prepare for the Saiyan arrival:
These are from the Daizenshuu 7;
With all of that taken into consideration then it is understandable why these 4 would get down Snake Way faster!
#3 I defeated Recoome, but Vegeta did not
Defeating Recoome was FILLER. Secondly, AGAIN Yamcha’s power level would understandably be higher than the fighter he is comparing himself too. Vegeta was a little over 30,000 while Yamcha had been on King Kai’s planet training for months. So it’s easy to see why his power would increase enough to beat a Ginyu Force member. But again this was FILLER! Again, Yamcha tries to outshine Vegeta only to give himself even more grief by fans!
#4 I was the first and only human to try out the gravity machine one time but at least I was strong enough to move and shutdown the machine in 300x gravity where Goku struggled training under 100x gravity
The 300x gravity remark was good until he AGAIN compared himself to someone who had a lower power than he had at the time. Goku had just recovered from the battle with Vegeta thanks to a Senzu Bean and of course probably received a Zenkai. But since he was healing nicely in the hospital the Senzu Bean repaired his bones rather than his health since he was in good shape in the hospital (health wise I mean).
If you ask me I’d say his power was around 9,000 or 10,000 (like his father Bardock was before he died) considering he was “over 8000” by Vegeta’s Scouter and was literally near death after Vegeta left, he was in bed for a couple of months before he could even get a Senzu Bean so it makes sense that his power would increase after eating it. He even states that he feels himself getting weaker for not training for so long just lying in bed (similar to the heart virus in the Android Saga lying him out for about 10 days). Not to mention his base power on Namek was 90,000. I’d like to think that training under x100 gravity increased his base power by 10 because it makes it easier to calculate.
Now there is one important factor to take into consideration: Goku was weak before he trained in 100x gravity, but Yamcha was at full health!
Goku was training at 50x gravity doing sit-ups while hanging from the ceiling! He was nearing 10,000 when his spaceship hit a magnetic storm fluctuating the gravity from 0 to 100x rapidly not allowing him to get used to the random changes. He was exhausted when the machine hit 100x gravity so it makes sense that he could barely move!
Yamcha wasn’t tired at all when he went into the machine and cranked it up to 300x gravity!
While Yamcha was well over 10,000 in the Trunks Saga. After training on King Kai’s for a long period of time, I think it equaled around a year or a little over that. His power was probably just scrapping the 100,000 range. He was lucky to get out of the Gravity Room alive.
Not to mention that even though Goku got smacked around by 100x gravity, instead of working his way up from 50x to 100x gravity by going up 10x each time until he got to 100x, after nearly being killed Goku was inspired to master 100x gravity right away! Yamcha did not do this, he opted to go on a training mission instead of sticking around Capsule Corp. for effective training!
#5 After Cell’s defeat, my training went unknown cause I like being a mystery fighter
After Cell was killed by Gohan and we move on 7 years later, he told everyone that he quit fighting so that was pretty much all we got on the subject. What’s so mysterious about it? I don’t think he quit as soon as Cell was defeated he might have trained a couple of years and just quit all of a sudden, but that’s just me trying to get him SOME credit. It doesn’t really matter if you are a mysterious fighter if all you do is run from fights.
#6 I defeated Olibu with ease but Goku and Pikkon did not
Olibu…again FILLER not to mention Goku didn’t fight Olibu (unless you count the video game Buu’s Fury, but then again that’s a video game not the anime). Pikkon was wearing his weighted clothes not to mention he didn’t use Thunder Flash or any energy attack for that matter. That shows right there he was holding back A LOT of power. To me it was more of a test because Olibu had a reputation around Grand Kai’s planet like Pikkon. Both were known for their strength and Pikkon was most likely testing the warrior’s power. It was clearly a hand to hand combat match, but of course it was more epic than the one we see from Yamcha fighting these two dead warriors.
Overall, this is probably one of the memes on the Internet that makes Yamcha look worse than he has even looked before.
What do you think?
By Jeremy Carden
The purpose of this blog is to hopefully settle a long standing debate to decide who the most powerful earthling in the series is.
And I can tell you right now that it is not Mr. Satan!
And it isn’t Uub either! True before fusing with Mr. Buu in GT to become Majuub, Uub was 100% human but the fact that he was the resurrected form of Kid Buu kind of leads to an unfair advantage.
In any case, the two humans or should I say super humans up for the #1 spot are Tien and Krillin.
Based on interviews by Akira Toriyama, it is said that Krillin IS the strongest earthling meaning that he is superior to Tien.
However, I have room for doubt mainly due to what I’ve seen in the series. I’ve read the manga once so I can’t really use a lot of information from it. Most of my reasoning will come from the anime which I’m sure most of you are familiar with.
First I’d like to clear the air of something a lot of people throw in Tien’s direction; Tien isn’t 100% human because he is said to be the descendant of the Three-Eyed Clan. Well it is mentioned in the Daizenshuu books, some online biographies of the character and other sources. The only time I remember seeing anything about him being “related” to aliens through having a bloodline involving the Three-Eyed Clan was in a video strategy guide book that I read a long time ago.
Even so I doubt that it has anything to do with making Tien a full on alien or even partly one. I mean from what I could gather from a lot of reliable sources was that Tien actually gained his third eye through intense meditation. Similar to Piccolo we see Tien power up through mental preparation and spiritual enlightenment. So, if Tien IS a descendant from the Three-Eyed Clan that could potentially mean that the only way he could have gotten his third eye was through that meditation and not from birth. I know we see him with that extra eye as a kid training with Tao but maybe he started meditation at an early age?
Honestly, I don’t know who cares anyway?
Tien has an extra eye but Krillin doesn’t have a nose! So that’s that and I feel that even if Tien is a descendant of that clan it doesn’t really make him any less human than Krillin and puts him in fare running for this comparison.
For this I’ll be breaking it down into 6 categories:
Category #1: Training
Krillin began his training as a member of the Orin Temple where he was bullied by the stronger and much taller students before he became fed up with their bulling. He then ventured off to find the legendary Master Roshi and from there trained with his rival turned lifelong friend Goku for their first World Martial Arts tournament.
Thanks to their strict training schedule, he was able to raise his abilities from “normal human standards” to superhuman due to surpassing the normal limitations of human strength. He proved to be a strong contender in the World Tournament until he met his match in his master disguised participant: Jackie Chun.
From there until the beginning of the next tournament, he went back to Roshi’s island to once again continue his training for the next tournament alongside Yamcha. His power did increase but not as much as Goku’s thanks to his power going up through battling the likes of the Red Ribbon Army, training with Korin and his 3 years of traveling on foot around the world.
After being wished back with the Dragonballs, Krillin went to train with Korin before the 23rd World Tournament and that raised his power quite a bit. He was even shown to now be able to fly and use powerful Ki attacks.
During the 5 year gap between DB and DBZ it appears that Krillin was living at Kame House and he might have done a bit of training while he was there. It was shown that his power level was 206 when compared to Roshi’s 139 possibly proving that he had finally surpassed his master. I know his number is higher than Roshi’s but remember Master Roshi could still bulk up to his “MAX POWER” form for battle increasing his strength.
Until the Saiyans arrived, Krillin trained at Kami’s Lookout for an intense training session increasing his power to over 1,000.
After the battle with the Saiyans, he went to Namek with Gohan and did some mind training to help hone their skills before touching down on the planet.
Although he did not do any real training on Namek he did get a power boost from Guru that released his unlocked potential. I’ll get more into that when I get to the Power Level section of this blog.
He was dead for the remainder of the saga after Frieza blew him up and was wished back with the Namek’s Dragonballs on Earth later on.
Despite the Garlic Jr. Saga being filler, we don’t see him training just hanging with his then girlfriend Marron and fighting Garlic’s men.
Before Mecha Frieza returned, Roshi comments that ever since he broke up with Marron he has been training at a serious level that he hadn’t done before.
After Trunks departs leaving them with the message of the Android threat on the horizon, Krillin AGAIN goes to Roshi for training.
He does do some sparring with Yamcha to prep for the Cell Games but that only goes as well as could be expected…
7 years after the threat of Cell, it is learned that Krillin had given up fighting to become a family man with his wife 18, daughter Marron and he lives at Kame House: my guess is that Roshi only agreed to it since 18 would be living with him.
It was mentioned that he grew his hair out since as a fighter dedicated to training a bald head was a symbol of that or something.
The only time(s) we see him training is before the World Tournament with 18 in order to win prize money to leave Roshi’s house.
Later on he and Yamcha are seen training on Grand Kai’s Planet showing the two to actually be more or less even with each other despite BOTH saying that they had given up fighting after the death of Cell.
He is older in the later years of Z and practically an old man in GT so that pretty much covers ALL of the training that he endured as a Z-Fighter.
Now let’s move on to Tien:
Like Krillin, Tien began his training at a young age but instead of simply training to be a martial artist…Tien was trained to be an assassin!
Training with Mercenary Tao and Master Shen, he learned how to be a cunning, deceptive, powerful and dangerous warrior.
He knew about pressure points and how to cripple/immobilize his opponents which proved to be quite effective when we saw him fight in the World Tournament against Yamcha, Jackie Chun and Goku.
After changing his ways, his training shifted from martial arts to the Evil Containment Wave in order to end the threat of King Piccolo after Roshi had died in his failed attempt. In only a matter of days, Tien had mastered the technique but was saved by Goku’s intervention that killed Drum and Piccolo.
Later on, he went to Korin’s Temple for some training with the feline master for the next tournament with the desire to defeat Goku (who at the time was training with Kami).
During the 5 year gap between DB and DBZ, he was off training around the globe with his companion Chiaotzu.
He then ventures to the Lookout to train for nearly a year for the Saiyan threat raising his power over 1,000 like the rest of the Z-Fighters.
After dying, he goes to King Kai’s Planet and that proved to raise his power level a considerable amount. He went from being beaten around by Nappa to being able to EASILY defeat Burter and Jeice at the same time!
He remained there longer than Yamcha before being wished back with the Dragonballs so it can be assumed that he raised his power level a good deal before finally being wished back.
Moving forward 1 ½ years later before Goku returned after the battle on Namek, he is shown to again be traveling for some intense training.
After Trunks leaves, he decided to train like never before in order to be prepared for the Android threat.
He was actually going to take a trip into the Hyperbolic Time Chamber before the Cell Games but after Goku (as a Full Power Super Saiyan) admitted to being no match for Cell, Tien decided to step down since despite a power increase for training in the chamber for a year, he figured that it would not be enough to even hold a candle against Cell.
Finally, after Cell’s defeat he says that the others would probably never see him again as he would isolate himself from humanity to train. His last appearance in battle was to save Dende from Buutenks’ attack before being knocked out later on with a kick from his lower half cut off by Goku.
It can be assumed that despite not being seen at the final tournament, Tien was still in training around the Earth.
We even see him meditating under a waterfall at the end of GT where he spots Goku riding off with Shernon into the sky.
Alright I have to give this round to Tien because the man NEVER stops training in order to improve his skills. This was clear after learning about Goku training with Kami and I believe it was Yamcha or Krillin who mentioned that if he is training with Kami not only was he the best in the world due to him stopping King Piccolo but now training with the Guardian of the Earth means that the gap between their powers would never be closed. This lead to Tien saying that no matter what he was going to train even harder in order to beat Goku in the next tournament and that kind of never say die attitude was what helped him get even stronger.
Then hearing that Goku had defeated Frieza as a Super Saiyan making him the best in the universe, he even thinks to himself that he’d like to fight him just to see how he would measure up in the universal ranking! Talk about a real contender!
Krillin is strong but his “breaks” in training really hurt more than helped increase his skills not to mention he was walking in the shadow of Roshi much longer than he should have. Instead of training under him for so long he should have been like Goku or Tien by travelling the world for training rather than just doing the same thing over and over simply shooting Kamehameha Waves at the ocean.
Even after learning about the Android threat he decided to train with Roshi which made little to no sense at all to me…
So that is why I feel that Tien wins this round!
Category #2: Battles
Throughout the series, both fighters had numerous amounts of battles and most of which were with characters more powerful than themselves.
If I had to pick from the DB days Krillin’s best battle, I’d have to say it was his fight with Piccolo Jr. Even though he lost that match, his skill was enough to surprise even Piccolo! He learned how to fly, manipulate Ki to distract Piccolo for a punch to the face and even stood up after being hit extremely hard into the ring.
Tien’s was most likely his fight with Goku both times in the tournament and even though Goku won the fight physically, Tien won the fight by technicality. In their rematch, Goku was superior but Tien had some new tricks like the Multi-Form that even caught Goku off guard a few times. Not to mention he put up a good fight against Piccolo’s minion Drum but had to be saved by Goku.
In DBZ, these 2 didn’t really fight in a major battle until the Saiyans arrived.
Of course we all know that Tien’s main “fight” was against Semi-Perfect Cell holding him off with the Neo-Tri Beam! That had to be a powerful attack to keep an opponent who was stronger than Android 16, Kamiccolo and Android 17 in check.
Krillin’s only “real fight” in my book was against Frieza but even then it wasn’t a fight but more of stalling and staying alive while Dende healed Gohan.
However, Krillin did fight ALL of Cell’s forms!
True some of those “fights” were filler but still worthy of note.
Overall, Krillin didn’t have a lot of wins in DBZ but he knew how to escape fighters like Frieza, Cell and Dodoria with crafty moves like the Solar Flare up his belt; which he totally stole from Tien….
I know movies are not canon but if I were to pick out at least one that was worthy of note it would be Tien vs. Future Trunks in Bojack Unbound.
Krillin was freaking out about his battle with Piccolo especially in terms of being killed with the Special Beam Cannon. So in a comical fight that was so ridiculous that even Piccolo forfeited, Krillin won…
Tien on the other hand faced his opponent like a champ and asked Trunks to not hold back and their fight was a couple of minutes long but one of the best parts of the movie in my opinion.
He was pretty much holding his own against Trunks who had trained twice in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber!
If you ask me I think that Tien was holding his own and actually winning the fight due to being the more experienced fighter even landing a blow to Trunks’ face!
However, he turned Super Saiyan…
But still Tien did not back down!
Yamcha gave up the will to fight after learning Gohan and the others entered the tournament
Krillin was freaked that Super Saiyans were in the tournament
But Tien stood his ground!
Even though he lost he fought to the end!
But looking at the main series…I suppose that since Krillin actually battled Frieza (since Tien was dead), pretty much all of Cell’s variations along with Super and Kid Buu I’m gonna have to give this round to Krillin
Tien’s battles were more impressive in my book BUT Krillin faced down a lot more opponents. Heck remember that he ALMOST killed Frieza with his trademark attack and that was certainly worthy of merit!
Category #3: Bravery
This round is a bit more difficult because despite Tien and Krillin being highly outclassed by the Saiyans and other alien races they still train and fight even in battles that they know they cannot win.
Krillin basically has a reputation of being a coward and for good reason. I could be here for a week going down a list of all of the time Krillin either ran from a fight, complained about being so weak that he had no chance of winning or how he would die without having a girlfriend.
In terms of bravery, I feel that Tien is no doubt the braver warrior. Whether it comes from him being trained as an assassin from childhood basically wiping out fear from his mental dictionary or what he was certainly a warrior not afraid to take on tougher opponents because it would make him stronger.
Krillin did show some spine during the fight with Nappa and Vegeta especially after Yamcha died and he took out 3 Saibamen with one shot. Then he protected Gohan a couple of times as well in order to save him from the Saiyan’s wrath.
The highlight of his bravery came in the Buu Saga when he opted to stall Super Buu as long as he could for the others to escape into the Lookout to hide. In his mind he mentioned how not even Gohan, Goku or Vegeta could stop this beast so he had no chance but decided to give his life for this friends and family.
Looking back at the Cell Saga, he was brave taking on Cell multiple times but let’s face it most of those bouts were out of his “love” for 18 or a pretty girl (remember that time he faced Imperfect Cell to help that girl and her brother escape).
I think that we can all agree that Tien’s finest moment was when he used his Neo Tri-Beam to stall Semi-Perfect Cell from absorbing 18 and becoming perfect.
The guy was putting his life at risk to stop the Android threat and succeeded for the time being until Vegeta AND Krillin’s selfish desires allowed Cell to reach his perfect form.
After some debate, Krillin did jump in to fight Kid Buu proving that he was at least braver than Yamcha!
Krillin does jump in to help his friends but only after a lot of stalling and going over his options. He was quick to criticize Piccolo for jumping in to help Gohan in his beam struggle with Cell only for Tien to cut him off saying that he KNEW he didn’t have a chance but did so anyway because sitting on the sidelines wasn’t worth it unless he fought until the very end.
This inspired Tien to be the FIRST to power up before flying off the help. Not counting Vegeta, Krillin was the LAST to fly off to help meaning that even Yamcha grew a backbone before Krillin!
Going back to his decision not to train in the Time Chamber, before getting to the battlegrounds of the Cell Games, Tien and Yamcha said that they’d go to watch but not participate due to the power of Cell being far too great. So he respectfully bowed out…
But overall, Tien has been facing down giants for quite some time even before Z with opponents like King Piccolo. Krillin is brave especially for his size but overall I’ve got to give this point to Tien because he never backs down.
Not to mention in Battle of Gods, Krillin ran away when Bills attacks but Tien jumped in!
And even though he was easily tossed aside when his fist was caught but chopsticks he still attempted to fight which was more than Krillin attempted to do!
Category #4: Techniques
To keep things simple I’ll just be using the techniques that these 2 have become popular for like Krillin’s Kamehameha or Destructo Disk along with Tien’s Tri-Beam and Multi-Form.
I’ll say that in terms of Ki manipulation, the winner would be Krillin because the guy can come up with some techniques that will help him contend with even the most powerful beings in the universe. If not for Vegeta’s intervention, Nappa would have been killed with the Destructo Disk.
He ALMOST killed Frieza in his 2nd form with his Chain-variation of the move that cut off his tail.
Of course being a student of Roshi, he was able to use the Kamehameha and even proved to manipulate it against Garlic Jr. to catch his opponent off guard.
Ki attacks aside, I’d have to say that martial arts master goes to Tien because he never stopped training in order to improve his skills making him a VERY skilled combatant.
Not to mention that many of the crafty moves Krillin uses to hold his own against powerful opponents came from Tien like the Multi-Form and Solar Flare.
Also remember the Tien is able to counter the Kamehameha Wave
He even shocked Jackie Chun using the wave during their match at the World Tournament because he deflected Yamcha’s in round 1 and somehow mimicked it with ease
His multi-arm ability might prove to be a challenge for Krillin also in terms of close combat
I mean I think that his power level is higher than Krillin’s so if both of them split into 3 or 4 bodies then I think that Tien would still be more powerful than Krillin’s duplicates.
Tien would have the upper hand but I wouldn’t be surprised if Krillin came up with an off the wall tactic to get back into the game.
Also remember that their techniques don’t mean that their power levels are off the charts but are specifically designed to do damage to their opponents.
Like Krillin vs. 2nd Form Frieza, his power level was over 1 million while Krillin’s wasn’t even 100,000 but the Disk is specifically an attack that cuts through nearly everything and it cut Kid Buu in half!
However, it just bounced off of Perfect Cell’s neck…
Tien’s Neo-Tri Beam is a barrage of powerful blasts that push back the opponent. Semi-Perfect Cell could only be bested by an Ascended Super Saiyan. That doesn’t mean Tien’s power level was as high as say Super Vegeta’s but it just means that the technique was designed for that purpose to impact the opponent with a continuous stream of Ki blasts.
Hear me out on this one! Although Tien’s Tri-Beam was enough to hold Cell at bay it is a move that is deadly to his opponent but potentially deadlier to Tien being that his own life force is used up for the move depending on how much he uses it.
Krillin’s signature move isn’t the best move in terms of accuracy especially if his opponent is fast. While the Destructo Disk is deadly, if it misses the opponent then what’s the use?
The reason I give this point to Tien is because Krillin uses most of Tien’s attacks so that pretty much explains it.
In Bojack Unbound, Tien use what looked to be a Destructo Disk but it didn’t cut Trunks but exploded on contact (remember it was a tournament so killing was not allowed, so Tien might have used a variation of the technique). But I’d say that Krillin used more of Tien’s moves than Tien did for Krillin’s moves.
It makes sense because the two trained together at Korin’s then on the Lookout so learning each other’s moves was probably a common practice.
Category #5: Power Levels
Now we all know that after the Frieza Saga, power levels were no longer recorded so I’ll have to be making assumptions in most of my numbers.
Looking at V-Jump and the Daizenshuu the highest power levels listed for Krillin and Tien are as follows;
Tien was 1,830 while fighting one of the Saibamen and that is pretty much his only listing…
Krillin was over 10,000 while fighting Guldo and officially listed as 13,000 after receiving the “Unlocked Potential” technique by Guru.
And for some strange reason, V-Jump listed Krillin at 75,000 during the fight with Frieza!
I don’t know how that could be…
First off we know that Saiyans get a Zenkai not Earthlings so when Goku healed him with a Senzu Bean after he arrived on Namek we can assume that Krillin’s power level did not jump from barely over 13,000 to over 70,000.
I think the best piece of evidence of that theory is because when he and Gohan fought Ginyu inside Goku’s body (who had a power level of 23,000 and falling), Gohan and Krillin working together eventually managed to beat him down until Ginyu started realizing how to use Goku’s body beating Krillin, Gohan and Goku inside Ginyu’s body.
If I were to make an educated guess, after being healed by Dende after nearly dying by being impaled by Frieza’s horns that probably didn’t just heal Krillin but increased his power as well.
However, the theory to counter that is when Goku sensed Krillin’s Ki again before he was able to leave the healing capsule to save Gohan. He said that Krillin had returned but he didn’t say that his Ki had increased but more like something along the lines of “Krillin’s back!” or something like that.
Though while fighting Frieza in his first form, Vegeta mentioned that his power, Gohan’s AND Krillin’s was increasing with every attack making special note of Gohan having more power than he even realized. So I don’t know how much that means to Krillin’s actually power level increasing…
In any case, we know that Krillin trained for 3 years for the Android threat but stopped training after Cell was destroyed (the same as Yamcha).
Now in terms of Tien’s power level I’d say he was at least around 80,000 or so at the time of the Ginyu Force’s arrival on King Kai’s Planet. I know it was filler but still the two he fought (Jeice and Burter) were at least at a power level of 40,000+ not to mention he used the Multi-Form to split into 2 and was still making sport of the two.
He was also on the planet longer than Yamcha opting to remain dead until the Namek Dragonballs could be used 130 days later meaning he got more training.
Not to mention the 1 ½ before Goku’s return then another 3 years of training before the Androids arrived POSSIBLY but his power above 500,000.
Of course his power was again boosted after another 7 years of training between Cell and Buu.
I honestly, don’t think that Krillin OR Yamcha ever reached a power level that measured over 1 million but that is just my opinion.
If there was a human who reached over the 1 million mark it would be Tien.
Also keep in mind that although Krillin got his potential unlocked we have yet to see the limits of Tien’s abilities unlocked!
Category #6: Who would win?
If these 2 had an all-out battle, I’d have to cast my vote for Tien. However you’d also have to ask yourself when would these two actually battle it out in the series? If you ask me, I think that Krillin was in his prime after the 3 years of training for the Android Saga. For Tien that is difficult to say because he was ALWAYS training…
Let’s see I think it would be fair if their battle took place between their Android Saga personas.
Overall, Tien is the better fighter, tactician, is far more disciplined, braver and with 3 eyes instead of 2, I could “see” him being able to see Krillin’s moves faster than Krillin cold detect his.
As I mentioned above, if they used the Multi Form, Tien’s duplicates would be more powerful than Krillin’s.
I could see Tien somehow countering or deflecting Krillin’s attacks or even mimicking them.
He did fall prey to the Solar Flare when Goku used it on him so he isn’t immune to it.
I also think the Tien is faster than Krillin not to mention he doesn’t lose his cool in the middle of combat.
Trust me if Krillin used his signature move to cut Tien in half then it is lights out!
However, I could see Krillin being beaten by that Tri-Beam…
Looking at their battles from the Android Saga, Tien would get my vote no doubt as the victor!
So what do you think? Who do you consider to be the best of the Earthlings; Tien or Krillin?
This is one debate that is still going on between Dragonball fans. One has to wonder if this debate is discussed more than the Goku vs. Superman issue.
In any case, we all know that there are multiple forms of Majin Buu with Kid Buu being the original form until he started absorbing other beings into his body or when he split into a Good and Evil Buu.
The point of this blog is to go over my personal ranking of the Majin Buus from strongest to weakest.
I’ll be using facts, dialogue, fights and evidence from both the anime AND manga. This will help give you all an understanding of how and why I rank the Majin Buus in the order that I do from strongest to weakest.
Also understand that despite filler not being considered canon, I will use it for my discussion.
For example, Super Saiyan 3 Goku’s “fight” with Super Buu Gotenks/Piccolo absorbed (Buutenks) was filler.
So was Goku and Vegeta’s fight with Super Buu Gohan Absorbed (Buuhan).
Here are the Buus up for discussion:
Buff Buu-Kid Buu after absorbing South Supreme Kai
Fat Buu-Buff Buu after absorbing the Grand Supreme Kai/Daikaioh
Good/Mr. Buu-The Good Buu after splitting from his evil side
Evil Buu-the Evil Buu after splitting from his good side
Super Buu-the resulting Buu after Evil Buu eats Good Buu
Super Buu-Gotenks/Piccolo absorbed or “Buutenks”
Super Buu-Piccolo/Goten/Trunks absorbed or “Buuccolo”
Super Buu-Gohan/Goten/Trunks/Piccolo absorbed or “Buuhan”
Now here is how I rank them from strongest to weakest:
3. Buff Buu
5. Super Buu
6. Fat Buu
7. Kid Buu
8. Evil Buu
9. Good Buu
These are the topics that I will be going over to support my theories:
Overall, I’m going to throw everything I have at this in order to prove why thoughts on this so I hope you appreciate the hard work but also have patience because I know this is a long blog but it is covering some solid information in order to help you understand what I’m talking about.
Another thing that I do want to make note of is that I will not be using Uub or Majuub in my rankings because I don’t think it would be fair because he is Majin Buu reincarnated and before fusing with Good Buu he was 100% human. I will however make reference to him a couple of times though.
And no I will not be including the Majin Buus from the video games where he absorbs Frieza, Cell, Vegeta or Yamcha/Tien!
So, to get things started let’s take a look at what Majin Buu is. He is a creation by the evil wizard Bibidi who made Buu as a weapon of destruction in his conquest to rule the galaxy.
As Kid Buu laid waste to planet after planet in an endless domino effect of destruction there was little to no opposition that could stop him.
Even when the Supreme Kais came to fight none of them were able to defeat Buu.
Later on, Shin or Supreme Kai or Eastern Supreme Kai (whatever you want to call him) told Vegeta that back in his time all of the Supreme Kais were defeated by Buu and would have been able to destroy Frieza with a single blow
In the anime, he says that the Supreme Kais were all 1,000 times more powerful than Frieza
Just a couple of comments about that statement:
Due to Supreme Kai’s lack of knowledge about the Super Saiyans, I think it is safe to say that he also did not know about Frieza’s multiple forms.
With that in mind I feel that he was comparing his former Kai associates to Frieza 1st form which was clocked at 530,000.
By doing math based on his statement 530,000 times 1,000 would equal 530,000,000.
That number is over triple Frieza’s 100% power which was 120,000,000 but again this is all assumption based on Shin’s comment to Vegeta.
In any case, the Kais themselves were powerful but not powerful enough to defeat Kid Buu who effortlessly took them all down.
Save for South Kai and Grand Supreme Kai but I will get to my thoughts on their individual powers below.
Majin Buu can regenerate from molecules as Piccolo mentioned when Super Buu reformed after being blasted by the Super Ghost Kamikaze Attack followed by Piccolo and Super Saiyan Gotenks blasting the remaining bits of Buu to dust and the smoke from that reformed into Super Buu once again.
He can mold his body into different shapes and forms
A “volleyball” as seen when he uses the Mystic Ball Attack
Like the Nameks can extend and retract his limbs for long range combat
Fat Buu entraps people in his stomach to suffocate them by expanding his body
Super Buu has been shown to liquefy himself and “force feed” his enemy until their bodies explode into pieces
Something else worthy of note is his ability to break through dimension walls however it seems that he is only capable of doing this if he is EXTREMELY angry
Buu has a LONG list of powers that make him a very dangerous and unpredictable foe
His most famous power seems to be the Candy Beam which changes his opponents or anything that it hits into the food item of his choice; mostly candy or desserts
The only forms of Buu not shown to have this ability is Buff, Kid and Evil Buu. It is understood that Buutenks could use the technique as well but of course I’m sure he wouldn’t change his own competition (Mystic Gohan) into candy.
Buu’s speed varies depending on what form he is in. It seems safe to say that Buuhan is the fastest Majin Buu with the only being seen to be faster than him being Vegito.
Kid Buu is arguably the fastest but only if you throw the Instant Transmission or Instantaneous Movement into the equation but remember that is a technique not his own natural speed
I mean on multiple occasions Buu is seen outmaneuvering the Z-Fighters;
Fat Buu appeared in front of the fleeing Super Saiyan 2 Gohan who told Shin that he was pretty confident about his speed
Super Buu after absorbing Gotenks and Piccolo was easily able to swat around Mystic Gohan
Vegeta was no match for Kid Buu’s speed regardless of what form he was in whether it was base or Super Saiyan 2
Another thing to consider is that Majin Buu has an innate ability to mimic techniques used against him in battle.
This was seen when Fat Buu used a Kamehameha Wave on Super Saiyan 3 Goku after Goku used it against him to blow a hole in his chest
Kid Buu did the same just by seeing Kibito Kai using the Instantaneous Movement to escape the exploding Earth
During Uub’s fight with Goku at the end of DBZ, Vegeta mentions that the kid is learning how to fight while he’s fighting
Alright, so with all of these abilities taken into account let’s break it down into individual categories: stamina and durability
This has to be my favorite thing to discuss concerning Majin Buu because like the Energizer Bunny, this guy just keeps going and going and going…
There are only a few times when I can remember Majin Buu actually being tired
When Good Buu tries to hit Evil Buu with a melee barrage but not one punch lands he is seen catching his breath before being kicked away by Evil Buu
One could argue that it was because Buu had just lost a lot of power in the fission with Evil Buu taking more of his power and abilities leaving the Good Buu in a weakened state
Super Buu wasn’t tired but was seen reeling after a head butt from Gotenks
Buuhan was extremely tired from his fight with Vegito even to the point of not being able to fully regenerate but I’ll get to that once I discuss his durability
Kid Buu’s only time showing to be even remotely exhausted was when he delivered a fierce barrage of attacks to Good Buu’s stomach and said “Whew…” before wiping his forehead.
Let’s take a moment and discuss Kid Buu’s stamina for a second because I feel like he went through the most:
After reverting from Super to Buff to Kid Buu, he shots a Ki blast strong enough to destroy Earth but it is deflected by Vegeta so he uses the Planet Burst which has enough power to destroy Earth TEN TIMES!!!
He then destroys countless planets one after the other before going to Grand Kai’s Planet and easily took out the fighters there including Pikkon, Olibu, Krillin and all the others before being “called” to Supreme Kai’s Planet to fight against Goku and Vegeta
He is asleep before Goku powers up at Super Saiyan 2 to fight then goes Super Saiyan 3 before passing out due to exhaustion
Buu then takes out base form Vegeta before he engages in battle with SS3 Goku once again
After taking down Super Saiyan 2 Vegeta with ease…
In comes Mr. Satan!
Followed by a bout with the Good Buu
Then ANOTHER round with base form Vegeta
And finally we see Kid Buu vs. the Spirit Bomb!
He even manages to push back the bomb on a weakened Goku something no other villain has been able to do!
Until he finally meets his end when Goku’s power is restored and he goes Super Saiyan to finish the fight.
How did Kid Buu send back the Spirit Bomb although he doesn’t have a pure heart?
Just like the Super Saiyan transformation, the word “pure” could mean A LOT of things. Kid Buu does have a GOOD pure heart like Goku. Kid Buu had a pure EVIL heart!
King Kai nor any other being in Dragonball for that matter makes a good distinction of pure in terms of good and evil. I mean Krillin handled the bomb and although he isn’t evil, Krillin isn’t pure either. He lusts but not Roshi-level lust for women due to his desire for a girlfriend. I mean do you remember his girlfriend (filler) Marron?
Also remember the bomb was created by Krillin it was handed to Krillin by Goku and then pure hearted Gohan was able to bounce it back at the off guard Vegeta
Keep in mind that in Super Android 13, Goku turned Super Saiyan but it was only after the bomb was created so it could explain why Goku’s body absorbed it because the bomb was fading away and instead of letting that energy escape, Goku opted to use it to grant him the energy to finish the killer robot
Frieza is more or less 100% evil like Kid Buu but he was straining to push it back because he was off guard but not strong enough to push it back like Kid Buu
So, it could be a matter of power vs. pure beings. With that in mind it could just be that Kid Buu had more energy than the exhausted Goku and was able to push back the Spirit Bomb until Goku is restored to full power once again
Of course in the manga, after regenerating from Earth’s explosion he goes immediately to where Goku and Vegeta are to battle
Not only that, the battles that took place were Kid Buu vs. SS3 Goku, then SS2 Vegeta, a brief comical fight with Hercule and his last “serious” bout was against Good Buu followed by Vegeta stalling him for Goku to launch the Spirit Bomb
In any case, Kid Buu is pretty much all but unstoppable because as Goku pointed out fighting against him was like fighting a hamster on a wheel because no matter how much Ki he puts out he still doesn’t get anywhere.
But then again the same can be said for anyone fighting against Buu because he is pretty much all but unstoppable.
This is another interesting topic because it is nearly impossible to generate an attack powerful enough to completely destroy Majin Buu so not even a trace, cell or atom of him remained.
The only attack that was able to do so was the Super Spirit Bomb.
I will say that I do not believe Buu to be as durable as Cell.
Take a look at Krillin’s Destructo Disk for example;
After throwing it at Perfect Cell, the attack bounced off his neck and then crumbled to pieces with Cell just standing there in the process.
When using the attack on Kid Buu, it was able to cut him in half.
Even when Goku returned to Earth, he launched a surprise disk that cut Buutenks in half as well.
So he isn’t completely indestructible but thanks to regeneration and an almost limitless stamina he is all but unbeatable.
Though as seen after suffering from Super Vegito’s Perfect Game and Final Kamehameha attacks, Buu’s regeneration does have limits and if he is blasted too much the process sometimes does an incomplete regeneration and Buu has to put strain on himself (similar to Nail on Namek) to make himself whole again.
The only fighters shown to overpower or at least hold their own against Buu was Super Saiyan 3 Goku, Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks, Mystic Gohan, Vegito and arguably South Kai during his brawl with Kid Buu and Grand Supreme Kai against Buff Buu.
Kid Buu MIGHT win in terms of which Buu is the most dangerous and I agree due to him being 100% evil, a killing machine and basically doing what he was created for; being a weapon of galactic destruction
Heck he even tried to kill his creator once!
The only Buu I’d challenge Kid Buu with in this category is Buuhan but only due to him being far more powerful not to mention smarter (thanks to Piccolo in his head). True he isn’t as unpredictable because Kid Buu will either toy with you or simply kill you along with the planet you are on.
However, Super Buu can break through dimensions when pissed off and while Kid Buu does have a hyper scream I don’t know if he can do that with his Kiai. It might have to do more with power and anger than just anger. Super Buu was much weaker than Buuhan and he was only able to open up ONE dimensional wall to exit the Time Chamber while Buuhan opened up MANY gateways if you wanna look at it that way. Now if it is about power then Kid Buu would fall short.
Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks mimicked the ability but remember Super Saiyan Gotenks and Piccolo tried multiple times but it wasn’t enough but when he went Super Saiyan 3 did it everything just fell into place and BOOM they escaped so indeed power might play a factor.
Buuhan was about to rip apart the ENTIRE universe if Vegito wasn’t able to punch his lights out.
Kid Buu could destroy the universe given time and thanks to Instant Transmission it would be one planet blowing up after the next.
However, I might have to lean toward Super Buu or Buuhan in this category due to him breaking down dimensional walls all at once!
Now let’s take a look at the opponents who Buu squared off against and yes I will be including filler anime fights
1. Fat Buu vs. Dabura
Dabura mocked Buu for his behavior and he paid for it! Buu simply gouged his eyes and kicked him into a mountain. It stunned Gohan and Shin while Babidi screamed with glee at how powerful his “pet Majin” was. For the first time we see Goku stunned at the sudden show of Ki from Buu while he and Vegeta were far off in their battle.
2. Fat Buu vs. Super Saiyan 2 Gohan
While trying to escape, Buu swatted Gohan into the ground while beating down the Supreme Kai and when Gohan got back up he kicked Buu only for the point of impact to pop back out of Buu’s head like nothing happened. Kind of like a memory foam mattress and while Gohan rushed Buu he easily blasted Gohan into the air. But due to Shin’s interference he was able to save Gohan’s life.
3. Fat Buu vs. Supreme Kai
Shin threw everything he had whether it was the huge Ki blast seen in the picture or an eye Kiai blast it was clear that he was not match for the Majin who was about to eat him until…
4. Fat Buu vs. Dabura (Round 2)
Dabura threw a spear that Buu easily pulled out of his stomach and regenerated from. The Demon King still damaged from Buu’s earlier attack threw a barrage of melee and then Ki blasts that did nothing to Majin Buu whole then dodged his Stone Spit and countered with his Candy beam turning him into a giant cookie ending Dabura’s life
5. Fat Buu vs. Majin Vegeta
The 100% Super Saiyan 2 Majin Vegeta (thanks to Goku’s Senzu Bean) put up a good fight but was unable to keep up with Buu’s constant regeneration and even with the Final Explosion blowing him to bits…
6. Fat Buu vs. Super Saiyan 3 Goku
The debut of the Super Saiyan 3 form was the first to really show Majin Buu a REAL challenge. However, the more Ki Goku put out fighting, it seemed that Buu’s power continued to increase as well. Indeed showing that we never really see the Fat Buu’s FULL power due to captivity in his ball capping his power and this “exercise” helped him tap into it again
7. Fat Buu vs. base Gotenks
The cocky Fused Gotenks was easily defeated by Fat Buu and had to go back to the Lookout with a bruised body and ego after going on about how he was going to bring back Buu dead!
8. Good Buu vs. Evil Buu
If you ask me I think Evil Buu took over 50% of the power after splitting from Good Buu given how EASILY he was able to defeat his “better” half. I’d estimate at least 60%-75% of the power was given to him and after using his trademark move, Evil Buu blew back the Candy Ray to turn Good Buu into chocolate (talk about karma!)
9. Super Buu vs. base Gotenks
This fight was mostly just for show thanks to Trunks’ plan of putting on a show and then surprising Buu with his Super Saiyan forms. Even after his first melee brawl he realized that Super Buu was more powerful than he thought
10. Super Buu vs. Super Saiyan Gotenks
After kicking it up a notch showing that he could go Super Saiyan after fusing, Gotenk was still no match for Buu’s power and speed but due to his multiple and wacky attacks he managed to keep Buu at bay
11. Super Buu vs. Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks
This was a great fight showing that Gotenks proved the old saying “Anything you can do I can do better!” Buu was irritating Gotenks but whatever the Majin threw at him, Gotenks would throw right back! Mystic Ball from Buu turned into the Super Buu-Buu Volleyball attack from Gotenks! When he was finally about to finish the job…his Super Saiyan 3 power was gone!
12. Super Buu vs. base Gotenks
Enter “normal” Gotenks trying to stall Super Buu but to no avail. When your own Super Ghost question your orders you know you are screwed…
13. Super Buu vs. Mystic Gohan
Mystic Gohan came on the scene and simply dominated Super Buu, really there isn’t much to say here except why Gohan didn’t use any Ki attacks to simply kill Buu…
14. Buutenks vs. Mystic Gohan
Which is something he would come to regret once he absorbed Gotenks and Piccolo easily beating Gohan. If you ask me I think the anime’s take on this fight was more accurate than the manga. In the manga, Buu dominated Gohan the ENTIRE fight but in the anime, it was shown that the two were more or less even but only when Buu started taunting him (thanks to Piccolo) was he able to chip away at Gohan’s confidence causing the mighty hero to fight sloppy
15. Buutenks vs. Tien
Kudos to Tien for saving Dende’s life with his Tri-Beam to deflect Buu’s blast but it was to no avail when he aimed for Buu to no damage at all but that’s understandable this guy was beating Mystic Gohan to a pulp!
After Goku returns on the scene, he is easily knocked out with a swift kick from Buu’s lower half. At least Goku DID consider to fuse with him later on but due to being out cold that was out of the question
16. Buutenks vs. Super Saiyan 3 Goku
This was more about Goku stalling than actually fighting similar to his ight with Fat Buu so Trunks could get the Dragon Radar, he was waiting for Gohan to find the Potara Earring. This proved how Buu outclassed the Super Saiyan 3 in power AND speed with Goku not being able to land a punch. He landed a Kamehameha Volley (one blast to the chest) only because Buu was off guard blasting at Gohan
17. Buuhan vs. Super Saiyan Goku and Super Saiyan Vegeta
I love watching this fight but if one Super Saiyan 3 couldn’t handle Buutenks then two Super Saiyans wouldn’t have a prayer against the much more powerful Buuhan
18. Buuhan vs. base Vegito
Buuhan couldn’t inflict any damage on Vegito even after many punches and energy blasts. It seemed clear that Vegito could have defeated Buuhan without even going Super Saiyan (as Old Kai said in the beginning)
19. Buuhan vs. Super Saiyan Vegito or as most people call him “Super Vegito”
If base form Vegito could finish the job, then the 50 times more powerful Super Vegito could handle it as well. Beating Buu to the point that even his regeneration powers were starting to wear thin
20. Super Buu vs. Super Saiyan Goku and Super Saiyan Vegeta
Its true that the 2 Saiyans “beat” the first Super Buu but it was just a mind puppet I guess you could say but really they were in Buu’s head so they couldn’t really defeat him
21. Kid Buu vs. the fighters on Grand Kai’s Planet
Buu easily defeated all of the other fighters…um yeah that’s about it
22. Kid Buu vs. Super Saiyan 2 Goku
A very good fight with Goku even blowing Buu to bits at one point…only for him to regenerate. Filler only but still worth watching showing Goku could hold his own!
23. Kid Buu vs. Super Saiyan 3 Goku
The only fight that shows Buu being pushed back instead of doing all of the pushing…until Goku collapsed from exhaustion
24. Kid Buu vs. base Vegeta
After his rival passes out, Vegeta takes the stage! But why he decided to fight in base form is over my head. He just saw Super Saiyan 3 Goku pass out why wouldn’t he go Super Saiyan 2 to fight?
25. Kid Buu vs. Super Saiyan 3 Goku (Round 2)
This fight was good but the highlight is Vegeta finally realizing Goku is #1. And if not for his toying around before, Goku could have ended this fight instead of stalling for Vegeta to have a shot at winning
26. Kid Buu vs. Super Saiyan 2 Vegeta (Round 2)
Really something to see due to how “even” Super Saiyan 2 Goku and Buu were but how easily Vegeta got beaten but you can’t keep a good Saiyan down because Vegeta delivers some of his best pride dialogue in this battle! All seemed lost until the greatest hero ever stepped up to help out!!
27. Kid Buu vs. Hercule
That’s right Mr. Satan!!!! Who holds Buu off due to Good Buu torturing Kid Buu’s head. But he actually dodges a couple of Buu’s attacks that even manages to impress Goku!
28. Kid Buu vs. Good Buu
Honestly, the only reason Good Buu could hold his own was due to his regeneration abilities and the fact that he knew just about all of the same moves as Kid Buu but as the battle went on we see for the first time Majin Buu (in any form) run out of energy!
29. Kid Buu vs. base Vegeta (Round 3)
After being wished back, I can see why Vegeta wouldn’t be as durable as he was before while dead and his power wasn’t quite back yet so I guess I can see why he didn’t transform for this fight but he managed to stay alive in order for the Spirit Bomb to be complete!
30. Kid Buu vs. base/Super Saiyan Goku using the Spirit Bomb
Goku was exhausted and after some straining, Buu managed to throw back the blue ball until Goku’s Ki was restored and was able to finish the job!
Now let’s take a look at the strength of the people he absorbed:
South Kai as Shin pointed out is one of the Supreme Kais who could kill Frieza with one blow. Considering that he was the strongest of the 4 Supreme Kais of his time with the Grand Supreme Kai seemingly the only person in the Kai or guardianship position that could exceed his power, he was certainly not a fighter to be taken lightly.
If you ask me, I feel that South Kai is AT LEAST in the power level range of a Super Saiyan 2. The reason I say this is because as I mentioned before he was able to hold his own against Kid Buu in a melee brawl. I mean the only one shown to do that against Kid Buu was Super Saiyan 3 Goku. Heck, South Kai even managed to rip off one of his arms!
I estimate Supreme Kai/South Kai/Shin to be around the power of the Ascended Super Saiyans in the Cell Saga like Super Vegeta so I’d imagine South Kai to be in the range of Super Saiyan 2 or above but not quite at Super Saiyan 3. I think he’s strong but not THAT strong.
The reason I don’t believe him to be that powerful is because one kick from Buu pretty much jacked up his face as you’ll see in another picture from their battle. Goku was bleeding but it took A LOT from Kid Buu to make that happen to the Super Saiyan 3.
Grand Supreme Kai being the leader is the strongest and with South Kai by my estimation being near or above a Super Saiyan 2, this guy has to be strong! Is he at Super Saiyan 3 power?
But in any case he sure has some interesting techniques due to slicing up Buff Buu into pieces with a mouth blast! I’m sure he must use that on his food…
Piccolo or Kamiccolo is a fighter who I don’t wager to be as powerful as Gohan was against Cell. After his trip into the Time Chamber, I feel that he had the power to rival that of Ascended Super Saiyan Trunks and Vegeta after their first trip into the Chamber. He didn’t lounge around during the 7 years in between the Cell and Buu Sagas as Gohan did but I don’t think he spent ALL of his time training like Vegeta. It seems that most of his time was spent on the Lookout with Dende and Popo most likely just teaching Dende how to be a good guardian.
That being said, he probably increased his power but not to the point where he was double the power of his Cell Saga persona.
Gotenks as a Super Saiyan 3 is hands down one of the most powerful fighters in the Dragonball universe. His strength is above Super Saiyan 3 Goku and it could be argued that he did have the power to kill Super Buu but due to Buu’s endurance, Gotenks’ cockiness preventing him from finishing the job and the time limit on both his Super Saiyan 3 power and fusion time running out kept him from victory.
Goten and Trunks are more or less even and I think in base form they’d be around the power of Frieza’s 1st form of 530,000 and as Super Saiyans that would put them over 26,000,000 but again that is just an estimate and I’ll get into more detail in another blog.
Mystic Gohan is the strongest of any of the people that Buu had ever absorbed. His power was greater than Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks or Goku. He was the only fighter capable of going toe to toe with Super Buu.
The purpose of Absorption: This is just a point I’d like to make regarding the power of Kid Buu.
Why does Majin Buu in any of his forms absorb another being into his body?
Essentially it is to add more power to his already impressive power level.
If you ask me that is the overall purpose of it.
I believe that the one exception would be Piccolo. True he was absorbed at the same time as Gotenks who was obviously absorbed just for his power which Buu knew would only last for 30 minutes in order to defeat Mystic Gohan.
Piccolo was more or less an extra bonus because think of it this way, if he had just absorbed Gotenks, Buu would of course be extremely powerful but he wouldn’t really know what to do with the power.
Super Buu on his own was a bit more mindful than Fat Buu but not the brightest fighter as seen when Gotenks used the Super Ghost to fool him into thinking a piece of candy was on the floor of the Time Chamber to have him drop his guard and get blown up.
But with Piccolo, he’d be able to outsmart his opponent using not just power but psychological warfare which he used well against Gohan to lower his confidence slowing taking away his power in the sense that he wouldn’t be able to fight at his maximum because his emotions would cloud his judgement.
I mean the reason I think Buff Buu is STRONGER than Kid Buu is because Buu would not have absorbed him in the first place unless he felt that South Kai was a being worth absorbing.
West and North Kai didn’t do much against Buu and when he faced South Kai it was shown to be his first real challenge, someone who Buu couldn’t just swat away like he did the other 2 Kais or the inhabitants of the numerous planets he destroyed.
I mean when he faced Grand Supreme Kai it seemed like he finally met his match because of one mouth blast chopped Buu into pieces and then made him explode.
He probably figured that of course this Kai was stronger than South Kai and wanted to add the extra power to his being but did not know the power of Grand Kai wouldn’t be the ONLY thing he’d absorb.
It seemed that Grand Kai’s goodness was more powerful than Buu’s evil. Explaining why he became the fat and jolly Buu rather than the killing machine Kid Buu or the tank that was Ultra/Buff Buu.
I don’t think South Kai’s goodness was stronger than Kid Buu’s evil I mean we don’t see much of Buff Buu but I doubt he was anywhere near as gentle as Fat Buu.
The reason I am including this is because a lot of people think that Kid Buu is the strongest.
To all of the people who say that answer this question for me: if Kid Buu (who Super Saiyan 3 Goku said he could defeat but only if he could emit 100% of his Ki at once to kill him) is stronger than Buuhan then why didn’t Goku just go Super Saiyan 3 and defeat him in the Fusion Saga?
The answer; BECAUSE HE COULDN’T!!!!
Remember Goku was so desperate for extra power when Buuhan was going to allow him til the count of 5 to find someone to fuse with that he was about to throw the Potara Earring to HERCULE!!!
Even before he threw it he contemplated the pros and cons:
1. Mr. Satan’s lack of Ki knowledge could do more harm than good
2. He DOES know basic martial arts
3. Fusing with him could actually LOWER Goku’s power rather than increase it!
If not for him sensing Vegeta’s Ki, that fusion would have happened
Remember against Kid Buu, he and Vegeta both agreed that they did not want to use the Potara again due to it being permanent.
Goku says that since Buu isn’t a fused being anymore that it wouldn’t be fair and he opted to fight solo; this happened in both the anime and manga
Instead of using the Fusion Dance as Old Kai predicted they did the next best technique; Rock, Paper, Scissors!!
Going off another piece of dialogue that makes fans speculate that Goku could not defeat Super Buu (even before absorbing the Z-Fighters) due to him saying that if they escaped Buu’s head they way that they were now (being in their base forms and the highest Goku could go is Super Saiyan 3 and Vegeta could go Super Saiyan 2) and he said Fusion was their only option to survive when getting to the outside.
Makes sense to me due to how strong Gotenks and Gohan are and they were the only ones who could smack around Super Buu like he was nothing.
Of course how can I talk about this subject without going into detail about Super Saiyan 3?
Goku said that if he really tried he could have defeated Majin Buu or more specifically the FAT Majin Buu but he wanted Goten, Gohan and Trunks to have a shot at saving the world because he wouldn’t be around forever.
However in the manga he sounds a lot less confident in his abilities to defeat the Fat Majin Buu when compared to the anime where he says “probably” but even so in the manga he wasn’t so sure
Later on he tells Vegeta that if he fought Kid Buu at 100% from the start he could have defeated him not to mention he needed a moment to collect the Ki needed to kill him but he couldn’t do that with all of the high paced fighting that he was doing with Kid Buu
Not to mention the Super Saiyan 3 confirmed that if Vegito was “here” the battle would be over in no time
This is one reason why I say that Kid Buu might actually be weaker than the Fat Majin Buu (not the Good Buu I mean the Buu we see after absorbing Grand Supreme Kai and the first Buu we see in the series after his ball is opened).
Here is one topic that needs to be discussed: Potara Earrings vs. Fusion Dance
A common misconception is due to the Old Kai’s double-talk. When Goku says that he’ll do a Fusion with Gohan and then beat Buu, Old Kai is quick to scold him. He says that Buu isn’t just going to wait around while the two practice the moves and align their power levels and he made a good point.
I’m sure at that point Buu knew that Gotenks’ fusion wasn’t going to last much longer and the last thing he needed was an even more powerful fused being going up against him when he was about to lose his main source of power!
In any case here is what the manga says about this moment:
If you ask me I think that Old Kai was referring from the pros and cons of the Potara Earrings vs. the Fusion Dance. In that case I could see why the earrings are “stronger” than the dance.
When it comes to the earrings all the users have to do is place one on the opposing earring as their fusion partner and BOOM there is an instant fusion.
From what I can tell there are only 2 drawbacks;
1. The Fusion is permanent
2. If one or both of the people fusing is in a powered up state (like Super Saiyan for example) when the merger takes place there will be a considerable amount of strain placed on the fused body and since most beings can not stay in their powered up forms forever it will shorten their life force or lifetime.
Now let’s look at the Fusion Dance in terms of cons;
1. One false move in the “dance” execution and the Fusion will fail resulting in either a fat or old and frail being
2. It takes a lot of practice and a good memory to remember the moves correctly
3. Both people have to emit the same Ki levels for the dance to work
4. Both people have to be of similar size
5. Depending on the power of the fused being it could actually do more harm than good with some fused beings being so powerful that it actually shortens the amount of time they can stayed fused; Super Saiyan 4 Gogeta only lasts 1/3 or 10 minutes of the total 30 minutes of Fusion
6. After a fusion (failed or successful) the two are unable to fuse for a full hour which isn’t good especially if you are fighting an extremely tough opponent
So, when you look at it that way, the Potara Earrings ARE stronger than the Fusion Dance. However, that doesn’t mean the resulting being is more powerful than the Fusion Dance.
Again, this is up to fan speculation because this is what it boils down to if you are trying to compare the power of Super Saiyan Gogeta and Vegito.
Here is where I get to the part of the blog where I confirm two things that I actually kind of doubt myself about;
1. Whether Buff Buu IS more powerful than Buuccolo
2. If Fat Buu IS more powerful than Kid Buu
Here is how I look at it when it comes to Buff Buu based on the power of South Kai. As I mentioned before, I think he is near or above the Super Saiyan 2 level. Piccolo is not as strong as a Super Saiyan 2 but still pretty powerful. Don’t forget that Buuccolo also has the power of Goten and Trunks. HOWEVER, in their people pods the two hybrids are in their base forms so the question remains as to whether or not Super Buu could access their Super Saiyan power. I know Piccolo is more powerful than them regardless of their form.
In any case, if Buuccolo is less powerful than Buff Buu then it doesn’t really matter because he is indeed a lot smarter. Buff Buu is like a rhino or tank just charging into his opponents with his huge body.
In a battle, I think that Buuccolo COULD win due to having brains and power.
I did list Super Buu to be more powerful than Kid Buu regardless of whether he is fused with anyone or not but also notice that Buff Buu is above him because Goku and Vegeta mentioned that he was increasing in both body and power instead of decreasing after ripping out Good Buu’s pod.
Though when he reverts to Kid Buu they mention he got “manageable” in that they could beat him but they were not prepared for his wild and berserk nature.
In any case, in terms of raw power I think that Buff Buu exceeds Buuccolo but in terms of who would win a fight I think it would be Buuccolo if he can come up with strategy and technique to overcome the raging beast
Now here is where I try to confirm why I feel that the Fat Majin Buu if more powerful than Kid Buu;
For one as I mentioned before, the purpose of absorption is to increase the already incredible power of a being by incorporating the power of another.
In both the anime and manga, it is suggested that by absorbing South and Grand Supreme Kai, Majin Buu’s power was dropped due to the Kai’s good influcence over him. Remember Kid Buu was 100% evil but by absorbing the Kais he not only took their power but also some of their personality traits and along with that was goodness. As I mentioned before, South Kai’s goodness wasn’t enough to overpower Buu’s evil but when Grand Supreme Kai was absorbed so was his goodness and that seemed enough to overcome Buu’s wild nature.
If you ask me I don’t think Buu’s power dropped where the Kais “took away” his power. I think it was just buried inside if that makes sense.
For comparison let’s look at Gohan: Remember it was said that the Fat Buu’s power just kept on increasing and it was like a bottomless well that was never ending.
It might sound wrong but actually it makes A LOT of sense.
He spent centuries in his ball so it makes sense that his power became “contained.”
From his brief fight with Dabura to his fight with Super Saiyan 3 Goku, it was said that the more powerful his opponent, the more Buu’s power increased.
Remember that Gohan reached his peak during the Cell Games when he finally delivered the final blow to the Android.
Though for 7 years, he spent his time going to school and studying like his mother wanted and actually dropped his power because when he went Super Saiyan 2 against Kibito, Vegeta said that he was a lot more powerful as a kid.
However, he still had a lot of power contained and it had to be released thanks to the efforts of Old Kai. I mean Goku and Vegeta were even at Super Saiyan 2 but more powerful than Gohan but after his power up, Mystic Gohan had the power to be stronger than Vegeta or even a Super Saiyan 3 Goku and Gotenks.
It is like an athelthe who was at his peak but stopped training and working out for a long time, their strength drops. The same with Majin Buu being in that ball so long or Gohan sitting at his desk studying so long, his power was still there but it is “hidden” once again.
Of course the best way to illustrate my point is to compare the fights between the dead Super Saiyan 3 Goku vs. Fat Buu against the alive Goku at Super Saiyan 3 fighting Kid Buu BUT while in the Other World.
I think this level of Super Saiyan should be a clear indicator of how strong Buu is.
The real question is: Is Goku stronger as a Super Saiyan 3 while dead?
I know that he said a living body chugs more energy than a dead one and in Other World, Super Saiyan 3 was “easy.”
Against Fat Buu, he didn’t take much if any damage at least on the outside of his body but against Kid Buu it was clear that he was damaged and passed out from exhaustion.
Perhaps his power isn’t different whether or not he is dead or alive. It might just boil down to the fact that while he is dead, he is better equipped to handle the form without the strain on his body.
When he was fighting Fat Buu, it was said multiple times that Majin Buu’s power was increasing to keep up with Goku’s beacuse he said that the more power he puts out the more powerful Buu became.
Against Kid Buu it seemed clear that the Majin was able to keep up with Goku but it was never said that he was getting stronger just that he had the speed and endurance to keep up with Goku. Though it has to be mentioned that the battle took such a toll on Goku that it got to the point where his attacks were not even fazing Buu anymore.
Similar to 100% Frieza vs. Goku on Namek, Frieza’s body was being strained by his power and he was getting weaker the longer the fight went on
So, if it were a battle between Fat Buu and Kid Buu I think that Fat Buu just might come out on top but with the Instant Transmission it might be possible for Kid Buu to win due to his berserk nature vs. the laid back nature of Fat Buu.
Really it is similar to Buff vs. Buuccolo in that it is more than just raw power but abilities.
Those were the only points that I felt needed to be addressed in terms of any doubts that I was having before.
Which is the best Buu?
When it really boils down to it, there are only TWO pure Majin Buus and those are Evil and Kid Buu. All of the other Buus have another being inside of them taking away from his pure Majin nature in both power, personality and danger level.
Look at the fission from Good Buu like Kami and King Piccolo
We have an extremely powerful being (Fat Buu) who is generally good but due to an unseen evil in their heart it must be expelled and the result is two beings of equal power but one good and the other evil.
However, in Buu’s case it is clear that the evil side is far more powerful than the good.
And that makes perfect sense!
Remember Kid Buu was 100% evil and only “good” after absorbing the 2 Kais and even then he wasn’t completely good and not completely evil.
And remember Fat Buu was generally good and hungry like Grand Supreme Kai however you could tell he was still somewhat evil. His eyes would open whenever he was mad or about to do something evil like kill people for no reason at all showing that the destructive Kid Buu was still inside of him somewhere.
The reverse can be said after Evil Buu eats Good Buu and the evil takes over with the Good holding him back with candy cravings and not killing Hercule
So, when you think about it Evil Buu is the physical manifestation of the evil inside of Fat Buu and really he could be interpreted as another form of Kid Buu.
Kind of like Gray Hulk is to Bruce Banner in that he is smarter and can talk clearer than Green Hulk; similar to Evil Buu and Good Buu
It is obvious Good Buu got the short end of the stick with Evil Buu pretty much easily swatting around his good counterpart and for some reason after coming together again to form Super Buu he could sense Ki…
Yeah I have to scratch my head on that one because it was as random as Vegeta learning how to do it after his beam collision with Goku back in the Saiyan Saga due to him saying as a Great Ape that he could “feel” Goku in the area while he was collecting Ki for the Spirit Bomb
In terms of which is the strongest or best Majin Buu then the obvious winner is Kid Buu since he is a PURE Majin Buu who is stronger than Evil Buu.
Though when you throw in his multiple incarnations including his Fusion with other beings then of course Buuhan is #1
One thing about Kid Buu that makes it difficult to measure his power is that he never fights seriously.
It seems like he’ll gladly take an attack that blasts him to bits but reforms like it was nothing.
It seemed that Super Saiyan 2 Goku was holding his own against Kid Buu but the Majin was EASILY able to beat Super Saiyan 2 Vegeta who is equal in power to Goku. That might be due to Goku being a superior marital artists than Vegeta or because Goku and Kid Buu was sizing each other up before the real fight began when he went Super Saiyan 3.
Though it is the unpredictability of Kid Buu that makes him one of my favorites I will say that much about him.
We saw the limits of Buuhan’s power since he could mimic the moves of the fighters he absorbed and because Vegito was more powerful than him so he had to pull out all the stops and from what we’ve seen I don’t know why people think that Kid Buu could defeat him
I mean take away the dialouge from the Kais about Kid Buu being the most powerful and please explain WHY he is stronger. I mean we are talking about Kibito Kai (50% Supreme Kai) who didn’t know the Super Saiyans existed, the Potara Earring effects and the list goes on about how bad of a guardian he is. So, why take his word so seriously?
I just feel that Super Buu or more specifically Buutenks and Buuhan were far more powerful than Kid Buu. The main reason why is that their existence demanded Fusion to be used to compete or beat them.
After Gotenks’ Fusion time ran out, Super Saiyan 3 Goku was confident that Gohan alone could finish off Buu
Well until Buu absorbed Gohan as well making Goku desperate for a Fusion partner
Goku was pretty confident in his own abilities to defeat Kid Buu and seriously, I think that he could do it if he had the time to gather the necessary Ki.
So that pretty much sums up why I feel that Buuhan is far more powerful than Kid Buu and why I rank them from strongest from weakest the way that I do.
Regardless of what the anime or manga says, I just feel that it is for a reason given the fact we are shown powerful characters like Mystic Gohan, Super Saiyan 3 Gotenks and Vegito who outclass Super Saiyan 3 Goku in power but Buu proved to be more powerful than Gotenks and Gohan.
Now it is time for the fans to speak up as to whether or not you agree with me and why.
Thanks for reading!